Stats

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timdef
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Re: Stats

Post by timdef » Tue May 21, 2013 8:08 am

i always curse "new" 15 and always swear it should be a 5... but I'm not very good. i've 4'd it only a handful of times. it might be too forgiving calling it a 5. partcularly when you consider 16, a waaaay different hole is also 5

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kenjiac
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Re: Stats

Post by kenjiac » Tue May 21, 2013 8:37 am

2 good shots gives you a birdie putt. It's definitely a 4.
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Re: Stats

Post by timdef » Tue May 21, 2013 8:41 am

kenjiac wrote:2 good shots gives you a birdie putt. It's definitely a 4.


i agree. i just struggle (being not very good) to put it all together! 8-)

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Re: Stats

Post by Morgan » Tue May 21, 2013 10:39 am

It's not a matter of opinion. It's a matter of stats.

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Re: Stats

Post by timdef » Tue May 21, 2013 10:43 am

Morgan wrote:It's not a matter of opinion. It's a matter of stats.


a perspective I appreciate!

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Re: Stats

Post by Morgan » Tue May 21, 2013 2:44 pm

I just did the averages for each hole, pro and adv men only, average of 94 rounds:



hole 1 2.74
hole 2 2.68
hole 3 2.52
hole 4 3.41
hole 5 4.82
hole 6 2.59
hole 7 2.82
hole 8 3.99
hole 9 3.72
hole 10 3.12
hole 11 2.64
hole 12 4.16
hole 13 2.89
hole 14 3.61
hole 15 4.57
hole 16 5.33
hole 17 4.32
hole 18 3.04

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Re: Stats

Post by Morgan » Tue May 21, 2013 3:28 pm

The simplest kind of stats is to simply round off:

hole 1 2.74=3
hole 2 2.68=3
hole 3 2.52=3
hole 4 3.41=3
hole 5 4.82=5
hole 6 2.59=3
hole 7 2.83=3
hole 8 3.99=4
hole 9 3.72=4
hole 10 3.12=3
hole 11 2.64=3
hole 12 4.16=4
hole 13 2.89=3
hole 14 3.61=4
hole 15 4.57=5
hole 16 5.33=5
hole 17 4.32=4
hole 18 3.04=3

hole 9 becomes par 4 and hole 15 becomes par 5. Hole 9 actually has a higher average than 14!

The par for the course would be 65.

But it's not that simple.

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Re: Stats

Post by Morgan » Tue May 21, 2013 5:21 pm

In ball golf, they determine par almost entirely by yardage. They adjust a little here and there for elevation and slope and stuff, but it's basically all about the yardage. That doesn't apply in disc golf. The longest hole at Hyzer is 12 which is 710 feet and is 100% par 4 in every way, and hole 16 is only 461 feet but averages 5.33 so go figure

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Re: Stats

Post by timdef » Tue May 21, 2013 6:46 pm

there's an old saying...

lies, damn lies, and statistics -- in that order

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Re: Stats

Post by Ven » Wed May 22, 2013 3:09 pm

Go for the simple par 65. I always thought 9 should be a 4

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Re: Stats

Post by Ven » Wed May 22, 2013 3:29 pm

Morgan wrote:In ball golf, they determine par almost entirely by yardage. They adjust a little here and there for elevation and slope and stuff, but it's basically all about the yardage. That doesn't apply in disc golf. The longest hole at Hyzer is 12 which is 710 feet and is 100% par 4 in every way, and hole 16 is only 461 feet but averages 5.33 so go figure

To get more complicated ball golf does adjust pars for hills. At Orchard Creek 14 is an uphill par 4 261 and 15 is downhill par 3 257.
This brings up my rant that disc golf is much easier than old golf. Except old golf rarely has trees in the fairway (except Mohonk #9 a par 5 478 with two massive pines in the fairway guarding the green.)

From http://golf.about.com/od/handicaps/f/faq_parlengths.htm
The current guidelines for men are
Par 3 - Up to 250 yards
Par 4 - 251 to 470 yards
Par 5 - 471 yards to 690 yards
Par 6 - 691 yards or more

And for women:

Par 3 - Up to 210 yards
Par 4 - 211 to 400 yards
Par 5 - 401 to 575 yards
Par 6 - 575 yards or more

It's important to note that the USGA guidelines are not, in fact, based on actual yards, but on a hole's "effective playing length." Effective playing length is one of the factors taken into account when a course is given its USGA Course Rating and USGA Slope Rating.

Effective playing length, and why it's used in these guidelines, is pretty easy to understand. Say a hole's actual yardage is 508 yards. That hole, by its actual yards, might be a par-5. But what if the hole plays downhill all the way? Its effective playing length might be closer to 450 yards. Therefore, a hole whose actual length might make some think it should be par-5 really only plays like a par-4. According to the guidelines above, that hole would be a par-4 (the guidelines are not hard and fast rules, by the way, but simply ... well, guidelines).

Prior to the introduction of effective playing length into course ratings, the guidelines were based on actual yards. It's interesting to see how they've changed over the years. We have three examples below; in each case, the yardages listed are for men:

1911
Par 3 - Up to 225 yards
Par 4 - 225 to 425 yards
Par 5 - 426 to 600 yards
Par 6 - 601 yards or more

1917
Par 3 - Up to 250 yards
Par 4 - 251 to 445 yards
Par 5 - 446 to 600 yards
Par 6 - 601 yards or more

1956
Par 3 - Up to 250 yards
Par 4 - 251 to 470 yards
Par 5 - 471 yards or more

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Ven
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Re: Stats

Post by Ven » Wed May 22, 2013 5:12 pm

Disc golf could add another yardage factor because of extreme dog legs like 8 and 9 to factor in that no one can park a drive from tee #9. You have to add a par because you can only park a drive on the 2nd shot, and that's a par 4. Park a drive on the first shot and it's a par 3.

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Re: Stats

Post by kenjiac » Wed May 22, 2013 5:21 pm

I gotta say that there are players that could park 9 by going huge hyzer over the top. Not many but not no one. And we can putt with the disc touching our stomach or chest. Lol :obscene-buttsway:
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Re: Stats

Post by Morgan » Wed May 22, 2013 6:10 pm

Some pros have said to me that they can't park 9 (Scott Howard, Eric McCabe, Craig Cutler) because they want to 2 it. Eric actually said I need to cut trees so he can do a sky hyzer over the dogleg and park it. I think I'll just call it a par 4 so all the 3's are birdies. I would have to cut bookoo trees to make it parkable for 2. So far the only 2's I've ever seen on that hole have been from fairway aces (100 foot putts).

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Re: Stats

Post by Morgan » Fri May 24, 2013 6:47 am

The definition of a par 3 is it takes 1 throw to reach the green and 2 putts.
The definition of a par 4 is it takes 2 throws to reach the green and 2 putts.
The definition of a par 5 is it takes 3 throws to reach the green and 2 putts.

So 9 is a par 4.

So is 14, can you reach the green in 1 on 14? Didn't think so.

15 is iffy as to what constitutes the green. The short tunnel in the woods? Or just the far portion of it. If the far portion of it is the green, it takes 3 shots to reach there. Takes two shots just to get to the beginning of it. So, 15 is a par 5, as the stats show.

Hyzer Creek is officially par 65 now.

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